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Thinking of buying a new computer
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Baggi



Joined: 31 Jul 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 4:36 pm    Post subject: Thinking of buying a new computer Reply with quote

About ever 5-10 years I go somewhere like Fry's and put together a new computer.

I know very little about the hardware, so I generally ask here, or I ask one of the guys at Fry's to help me out.

I like to grab top of the line stuff, or as close as I can get within budget.

But one of the issues I usually have is with the motherboard. I don't want a super awesome motherboard that I won't use half of it. I just want a really solid motherboard. One that doesn't repeat a lot of stuff that I will already have (like a sound card, video card, etc), but that is easy to put together and throw all my hardware into.

Anyone have any suggestions of solid motherboards to purchase for a new computer?

Also, any other suggestions I will take as well. My video card will need to run HDMI to my TV (Some video cards still don't have this for some odd reason) and I'll probably be getting everything. Monitor, sound system, key board, mouse, etc.

My old stuff will all go to the kids.


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Girmluhk



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was totally going to give you some motherboard manufacture's suggestions and maybe look up some boards - but apparently as I have had to build a pc in 4 years now most of my favorites are gone. (no more dfi lanparty, abit, and tons of others...holy crap) So now you pretty much should get an ASUS or Gigabyte board. I'd lean gigabyte.

What's your budget look like?


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Gorgok



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Onboard video nowadays comes from the processor most of the time it seems, so you pretty much will have it listed as 'supported only by CPU with integrated graphic' or something similar.

Onboard sound is also something i don't think most manufacturers even think of removing, its just there... The only real option here is how many output ports do you want and of what kind...

Number of video card slots (or does something else require PCIe x16 2.0 these days?) is still an option.

RAID or not is still an option.

ATX, micro ATX or mini ITX are still options for size which translates into what sort of case you want. (Mini being smallest.)

Number of ram slots and the total capacity of the slots are still options.

But really, picking a socket and finding the cheapest one that fills your actual needs and has good reviews is all i would do.

For my current plan i wanted a LGA 1155 socket, mini ITX, RAID capable, 16GB ram capacity (in 2x 240 slots), mobo with a full complement of 5 audio ports for the pretty standard 7.1 audio built in. I didn't really care about video, as it will be a server mostly, but the built in video on the processor supports the HDMI output on the mobo.

This here is what came out of that search as a cheap yet good reviewed board.



Last edited by Gorgok on Fri Oct 19, 2012 9:55 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Baggi



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the advice.

My budget is between 2 and 3 thousand.


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Baggi



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

$65 for a motherboard?

I swear the last one I bought, an ASUS, cost me somewhere in the hundreds. Maybe I'm getting old and senile.


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Gorgok



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That isn't even the cheapest option, as its got some features and its the smaller form factor.

And for a budget that high what are you looking for exactly? SLI/Crossfire? Even then you would be hard pressed to hit 2k without really going to the bleeding edge....


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K'Dahbruh
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd suggest going to CyberPowerPC and ordering a custom computer from there. You can get quality components, and you get them at a better price because you're buying a full PC. I've priced the components to make one of their PCs - the exact same components - at Newegg and Fry's, and it's a good bit more expensive to put it together yourself from pieces.

I'd suggest starting somewhere like this:

http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Mega_Special_IV/

You'll still have to know what you want, but they'll list the suggestions and price comparisons for you.

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Baggi



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How is there shipping, Kdah? I mean, am I going to buy out the butt for shipping?

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Baggi



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And what's the difference between PC1600 Ram and 1866mhz Ram?

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Girmluhk



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

a little speed, not a ton.

do you overclock your pc's at all baggi?


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Baggi



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, I don't bother with overclocking.

And I don't know if HDMI comes standard now on video cards or not, but I need a video card that will run an HDMI cable to my television set. I watch most of my television now through Hulu or Netflix and we watch it on our Samsung tv.

So I need to make sure that whatever graphics card I buy, it has an HDMI connector for me tv.

And looking through that site that KDah linked, computers are pretty inexpensive these days. Looks like I can get quite a bit for about $1,500.00. This includes everything though except for a printer. I'm going to get a new monitor, keyboard (Although I didn't really see any I like. Not sure I want a gaming keyboard.) mouse (wireless), speaker systems, headset, graphics card and sound card, lot's of ram (I seem to have memory problems a lot on my current system) the newest version of Windows...

Am I forgetting anything?

If anyone has specific suggestions, especially for a good headset (Are there any cordless ones that are inexpensive? They all seem to pricey for me) I'd appreciate it.

One final thing. My current headset only works through the motherboard. It doesn't work if I use the soundblaster I have. I have heard it's because I have to disable the motherboard one first.

If there is an easier way to do this with my new machine, I'd appreciate learning about it ahead of time. I'm a plug and play sorta guy. I want to get a good sound card and head set/speaker system combo that you just plug in and it sounds and works great, without having to worry about disabling the motherboard or other features.


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Gorgok



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Disabling it on the mobo is so simple anything else will be complicated really. While its booting it should post a message about entering setup with some key, like F1 or delete. Once there the menu system is pretty simple to navigate usually. Disable whatever onboard stuff, save & exit and you are now free of the annoying stuff ever bothering you again.

I think 1 HDMI is standard on newer video card's now. Just a quick look at a few and they all had 1 HDMI, 2 DVI, and then it was manufacturer/version specific what a 4th output would be.


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Girmluhk



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this is what I'd rec.

2,250. It's goign to haul major arse. :)

mega special 3.

CARE1: Ultra Enhanced Packaging Solution - Protect Your Dream System During Transit [+19]
CARE2: Cooler Master Thermal Fusion 400 Extreme Performance CPU - Thermal Compound Optimized for Thermal Dissipation [+10]
CARE3: Professional Wiring for All WIRING Inside The System Chassis - Minimize Cable Exposure, Maximize Airflow in Your System [+19]
CAS: Cooler Master HAF 912 Mid-Tower Gaming Case w/ Adjustable HDD Cage (Black Color)
CASUPGRADE: None
CD: 24X Double Layer Dual Format DVD+-R/+-RW + CD-R/RW Drive (BLACK COLOR)
CD2: None
COOLANT: Standard Coolant
CPU: Intel® Core™ i5-3570K 3.40 GHz 6MB Intel Smart Cache LGA1155 (All Venom OC Certified)
CS_FAN: Maximum 120MM Case Cooling Fans for your selected case [+9]
ENGRAVING: None
FA_HDD: None
FAN: * Cooler Master V6 GT CPU Cooler (Nickle Plated Double-V Heatpipe w/ Color Changing LED Cap) [+22]
FLASHMEDIA: INTERNAL 12in1 Flash Media Reader/Writer (BLACK COLOR)
FREEBIE_MB: None
FREEBIE_VC: None
GLASSES: None
HDD: 256 GB OCZ Agility 4 SATA-III 6.0Gb/s SSD - 420MB/s Read & 410MB/s Write [+47] (Single Drive)
HDD2: 2TB (2TBx1) SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 64MB Cache 7200RPM HDD [+112] (Single Drive)
HEADSET1: Creative Fatal1ty Gaming Headset [+49]
IEEE_CARD: None
IUSB: Built-in USB 2.0 Ports
KEYBOARD: AZZA Multimedia USB Gaming Keyboard
MB_SRT: None
MEMORY: 16GB (4GBx4) DDR3/1866MHz Dual Channel Memory [+66] (Corsair Vengeance [+48])
MONITOR: 27" Widescreen 1920x1080 ASUS VE276Q LCD Display w/ Built-in Speaker, DVI, & HDMI-Input [+339]
MONITOR2: None
MONITOR3: None
MOTHERBOARD: [CrossFireX] ASUS P8Z77-V LX Intel Z77 Chipset DDR3 ATX Mainboard w/ IRST, Lucid Virtu MVP, 7.1 HD Audio, GbLAN, 2x PCIe x16 (1 Gen3, 1 Gen2), 2x PCIe x1 & 3 PCI (Extreme OC Certified)
MOUSE: Razer Naga Epic USB Wired/Wireless Dual Laser 5600 DPI Gaming Mouse [+109]
NETWORK: Intel Pro Gigabite 10/100/1000 Network Card [+34]
NOISEREDUCE1: Power Supply Gasket [+5]
NOISEREDUCE2: Anti-Vibration Fan Mounts [+9]
OS: Microsoft® Windows 7 Home Premium [+104] (64-bit Edition)
OVERCLOCK: Extreme OC (Extreme Overclock 20% or more) [+49]
POWERSUPPLY: * 750 Watts - Corsair CMPSU-750TXV2 80 Plus Power Supply - Quad SLI Ready [+51]
RUSH: NO; READY TO SHIP IN 5~10 BUSINESS DAYS
SERVICE: STANDARD WARRANTY: 3-YEAR LIMITED WARRANTY PLUS LIFE-TIME TECHNICAL SUPPORT
SOUND: HIGH DEFINITION ON-BOARD 7.1 AUDIO
SPEAKERS: Logitech Z-506 5.1 Surround Speakers + Subwoofer System [+96]
VIDEO: AMD Radeon HD 7970 3GB 16X PCIe 3.0 Video Card [+252] (Major Brand Powered by AMD)


i priced it out on newegg. same system for about the same price.


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K'Dahbruh
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 7:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

$100 for speakers AND $50 for a headset? Why?

Why the Intel i5 instead of the i7?

Why not liquid cool? I've got it and my CPU never gets hot.

And I don't think the bleeding edge video card will give him that much more than one a couple of levels down and less than half the price.

And, I'd like to see these Newegg prices.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And Baggi, the shipping is free, if you go with the standard 5-10 day shipping.
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Baggi



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a few issues/questions.

1) Right now, my video cards overheat about once a year. So I generally go cheap with the video cards since I seem to have to replace them a lot. I do get into my computer about once a month (More during the summer) and blow out the dust and such, and vacuum up what I can, but I still lose a video card about once a year.

Will I be alright with this new configuration? I leave my cabinet door open but it still seems to get too hot. I don't want to pay a lot of money for a video card that is just going to blow out from overheating.

2) The headset, is it cordless? Is it pretty simple to deal with, just plug it in to my sound card and I'm good to go?

3) Looks like a nice sized monitor. I love it! Is it a solid monitor as well as huge? I have had monitors go out on me as well as video cards. Back when monitors were just starting with the flat screen, I paid $980.00 for a new monitor and it lasted me a year before blowing out on me. When I went back to get another one a year later, the same monitor was hundreds of dollars cheaper.

4) Will this system run video well? My wife and I watch a lot of tv online. So this system isn't going to be for gaming as much as it will be for watching tv. Right now I get this annoying message all the time, "High memory use" and hear the computer running, running, running. It's annoying as heck! I'd like to avoid that with a new system.

5) Power issues. In the past I have had power issues, not buying a large enough power box for the computer. I'm sure they will put a large enough power box in their, but will I have to do anything special with my power in my bedroom? Will this pull more juice than my circuit can handle?

That's about all the questions I can think of for now. It's right in my price range though, looks like a pretty good set up, if it all jives well together.


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Mohr



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you guys think of this PC? It has a NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680 which appears to be at the top of the benchmark tests, and its about $600 less than what Girmluhk proposed. Its also an Intel Core i7 3770k (3.50GHz).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883227417


Video card benchmark
http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/high_end_gpus.html

CPU benchmark: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i7-3770K+%40+3.50GHz


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Girmluhk



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thats a solid system as well. but it will also come without a ssd and slower memory, and no monitor, speakers, headset, mouse, etc...which is where the rest of the money on that upper build goes. It's a head to tail pc build.

I figured top of the line video card (7970 outpaces the 680 by a bit, and is 50 bucks cheaper) and a huge monitor would be a big deal in a gaming rig. Not so much a limited upgrade to the CPU. gaming and video watching doesn't need a mild upgrade or a bump to 6 cores. not to mention they'll OC your CPU for free from cyberpower. :P

You also have to factor in shipping costs if you newegg parse everything out.


to baggi's q's -

On the monitor - i really don't know about that one. You will get just as a good a deal ordering one from newegg or pickig one out at fry's. I have an ASUS right now and it seems fine - but I'ts pretty new. My last "budget" Acer lasted 5 years and is repairable (busted capacitors i need to pick up and solder back on it) So I'd recommend it as well. It actually had a better deep black and color profile. Go figure.

All of the non-build parts you might save money just having fun picking them out at fry's or microcenter or newegg. :) It's what you like. I hate gaming keyboards and love the old, heavy as poo keytronic/ibm keyboards. I use a wired mouse and don't care. You are doing some media center stuff with yours to you might want to just go shopping for that on your own.

As for power, and video - if this thing doesn't kill it I don't know what will. It shouldn't have ANY TROUBLE with anything you throw at it for a long time.


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Girmluhk



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oh and yes, you could totally liquid cool the inside of it - thats up to you. If you ever feel the need to upgrade and root around in there its your decision if you like to mess with that gear, are comfortable with it, etc. I don't really think its necessary and makes THAT big of a difference.

Oh, and if your video is dying once a year - thats really bad. I mean it happens, but usually only with poor quality parts. I had an ASUS video card that tried to die...I took that card's fan compartment apart and it was full of crap in every hole...once i cleaned it out it was a new card again. You may have to do more than just blow stuff around. It may take a 6 month cleaning depending on how dusty an area you live in. Also- leaving the case door open on your rig can often RAISE the temps in it. The fan's should be properly situated in a way that helps the air keep moving. If they are open to the air in general it may actually be detrimental to removing hot air.


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Gul'Wur



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I replaced my video card fans with liquid cooling unit modified from a processor cooler. Just needed to use some zip ties...but it's really awesome in terms of silence and cooling power. Keeping the card about 20 C cooler than with the original fan. So if you are into OCing, liquid cooling is the way to go on video cards, but it needs some work. And if you are into silent rigs, liquid cooling has no alternative. But Baggi, if you blow out video cards that often, you need to put some extra case fans in (if it is because of your high ambient temperature, if it's not, you need to get a new case). That way the whole rig keeps cooler, regardless of the type of cooling you use for your video card. And get a case that can support good airflow and additional fans - the one in Girm's build is really good (although super ugly, har!)

On monitors: I wouldn't recommend a TN panel to anyone these days, atleast if you use a computer for more than an hour a day and if you watch something with colours on the monitor. IPS is the way to go. Unfortunately they are a bit pricier but make all the difference in comfort. And 27 inch IPS panels are ridiculously expensive. These are of course matters of taste. Other people swear by high resfresh rate TN monitors.

Some other notes on Girm's build in a random order:
All the care options are a waste of money. Cooling pastes have no real difference to you (notice the mayo in the table). Wiring is as easy as 1 - 2 - 3 - zip tie and ultra enhanced packaging solution is just dumb: if you get a broken machine, the shop will automatically refund it, right? That's 50$ wasted.

Get extra case fans, because you have had heat problems in the apartment. (as is in Girm's suggestion)

Problem with a fan cooled CPU is that it dumps the hot air inside your case. With a liquid cooler, the hot air goes to the grill, which is next to the airflow out, which cools your whole case better. Anyways, if you don't want to go liquid, Cooler Master V6 is a very good CPU cooler. However, if you aren't into overclocking you don't really need a better CPU cooler than the boxed cooler and heatsink that come with the processor. If you want to go silent, get something else, V6 is quite loud.

SSD is a must, do not give up on that, and OCZ Agility 4 is a solid choice.

Headset: I don't really have any backed up opinion on these, except that I hate headsets where the headphones don't cover your ear completely. If they rest on your ear they tend to make my ear leaves hurt at least after a while. Material is also a big thing with these, and I'd heartily recommend going out and testing these instead of buying blind.

You don't need really 16Gb of memory. But since it's so cheap and it might come in handy in a year or two, should prolly get it.

That motherboard has a network card integrated so no need for an extra one.

Don't get the OC. If you need to overclock it later, it's easy to do yourself with Asus' motherboard controlling software TurboV.

Don't know anything about surround systems.

That video card is really the bang for buck on the really high end cards ATM. I wouldn't dish out that much for a vid card though. GTX 570 would be my choice, as it is 200$ cheaper and will satisfy your needs with ease. Nearly all games will run on ultra settings with that card for the next year and a half. Give or take six months. The 200$ extra will get you approx ½ year more "life time" on the card, until you have to change if you want to play on ultra settings. Will run any and all videos with no glitches.

Another thing people overlook is keyboard and mouse "man, it's just keyboard and a mouse, what of it?!". But: those are the things you use when you use your computer and if you have to use your computer a lot, it makes a major difference. And there are a lot of different designs and choices these days.

When you buy a mouse, you need to establish what kind of mouse user you are, ie. a clawer, a pincher or a palmer. Then you need to fit your style to the size of your hand and choose a mouse that suits those needs. Then you have a few choices left which come down to weight mostly and some little nitty things, like number of buttons, the ability to change dpi and such. I could never buy a Razer Naga Epic. First of all, it has a heap of buttons that I'd press accidentally, it would be too light for and it's way overpriced without having the actual features I need to have in a mouse. But for those it suits, it's awesome.

Keyboards have a lot of choices aswell. I'm all for PS/2 mechanical keyboards, because I got used to the IBM ticking when I was a kid and can write with these a lot better because the key type I use now reacts really nicely to soft presses. Also they have unlimited key presses at the same time, unlike USB keyboards. The bad thing with a mechanical keyboard is, that it's incredibly painful to write at work with a normal keyboard these days...

That's my opinion on these. Nobody asked, but I told it anyways *snickers*


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Girmluhk



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2012 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^ good notes!


I agree with most of it, I just added on certain things from what I inferred about baggi's preferences about pc builds. :P

Don't see how your link supports that thermal paste makes no difference...we all know we aren't using mayo, and there is a real gap between no cooling and paste. I honestly don't know much about the paste they are using though. I've used arctic silver 5 for years.
'
Oh, and i rec that headset because at it's price point it is comfortable, works well, and has full coverage. If I'm going to be gaming for 1-3 hours, it had better be a full headset and comfortable. I'm not working a darn drive thru.


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Baggi



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, that's a lot to think on.

I'm sure if I stopped buying $30.00 video cards and did a few small things my cards wouldn't burn out. And when I say they keep burning out, I had two burn out on me. 1 a year after I bought it. However, this cheapo one I have now has lasted me awhile, so maybe I just bought a lousy card?

I don't think I want to go all liquid cooled, or whatever.

As to the rest of your notes, there is a lot there. I won't be buying my new computer for another month or two. So when I do, i'll check back here.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sometimes they just burn out. I had on die after a year because although I thought i kept the fan fairly clean, i didn't realize that the copper heat sink was completely blocked with dust blown in there from the fan. So it just kept overheating until near death. Couldn't see it till i took it out to replace it. derp. So i prefer fan modules on my video cards that are kinda easy to keep dust free. if not, you may want to make a note for yourself like every 6 months to take the bad boy apart and clean her out right and proper.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most of the year it's pretty cool up here in Seattle and I don't really worry about it. I do blow it out once a month with the rest of the computer, even when it's cold.

It's just about three months in the summer, when we have no air conditioning and it gets up into the 80's, when I start to worry about it.


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Character Skills: Fizt Shakun, Cane Whappin

PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom's Hardware was my right hand man in my build. If your wanting raw rendering power with full shadows and sunshafts, go with a powerful discrete graphics card. I'm close to going from SLI to a single 600 from NVidia. And how do you burn out a gpu every year? Mine are made from Military grade materials..... What temps do you run at?

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